Moral Dilemmas About My Sister

Thank you for your response :)

@Flávia Oliveira Do you want to talk more about your situation

@Tea and Honey - Yes, I would love to, because I feel like it's the obsession that causes me the most guilt. And I can't resolve it.....

@Flávia Oliveira I'm here to listen :):):) Go ahead...!

@Tea and Honey - Thank you!!! My sister is one of the most important people in my life. I would give my life for her if necessary. And I think OCD attacks me for that very reason. The idea of perfection centers on my sister, regarding the theme of scrupulosity. It creates dilemmas: if my sister was capable of doing something less than right, and examples of actions she could take come to mind. And if I think so, I start to feel guilty because I thought badly of my sister. Among other things, if she has problems with other people and they speak badly of her, I start to wonder if she really did what they say, and you can't imagine the guilt I feel. I feel like the worst person in the world. I spend the whole day from the moment I wake up until I go to bed feeling so bad about myself and thinking that she'll never forgive me if she knows the thoughts I have.

@Flávia Oliveira Yes, OCD will attack what you most value. (Having said that, it's wonderful, by the way, that you care for your family. These days there seems to be a lot less care within families, and that is so sad.) So, what you are experiencing is classic OCD stuff. So let's talk about how you would treat this. First, you have to change your relationship with your thoughts. It sounds like you feel like your thoughts about your sister are "dangerous", or at the very least that they have meaning and significance. What you have to understand is that the thoughts in your head have no significance at all. The thoughts have no meaning at all!! They are like wisps of smoke 💨. They are just thoughts, and they don't matter. The way to beat OCD is actually to ALLOW the bad thoughts to run freely through your head. Don't try to fight them off. I know this sounds counterintuitive. Most people with OCD spend most of their day trying to fight off the thoughts. But it is a paradigm shift that everyone with OCD needs to take. You need to realize that the thoughts mean nothing, and you need to allow them to run their course. If you start to fight the thoughts, you are actually training your brain that the thoughts are dangerous. But allowing the thoughts to run freely--that's just the first step. The next step is to train yourself to resist all compulsions based on those thoughts. The compulsions are all our efforts to try to "fix our lives" because of the damage we feel that the thoughts have done. We have to learn to do NOTHING in response to the thoughts. We have to go do the dishes, feed the dog, go on walks--and live our lives. In other words, we have to learn to do NOTHING to try to fix the thoughts. So I'll describe what this looks like for me, and then let's talk about what it will look like for you. I had bad thoughts in my head all day about God. And what I learned is that I needed to just let those thoughts run rampant in my head without trying to stop them or fight them off. The more I was afraid of these thoughts or tried to "fix" them, the more tangles I got myself into and the more debilitated I became in life. I have learned that an OCD treatment, you DO NOT FIGHT OFF THOUGHTS. You must ALLOW them to run around in your head all that they want to. Instead, your job with OCD is to prevent yourself from taking any action based on the thoughts (which will be always a compulsion). Therefore, when I had a bad thought about God, I needed to learn to go on with my life instead of taking any action. This is the point of ERP (which stands for Exposure and "Response Prevention). The Thoughts are actually defined as the "obsessions". And the "response prevention" part means that we don't take any action based on the thoughts. So, in your case, you have to practice allowing the bad thoughts to run around freely in your head. And then you practice doing nothing about the thoughts. Just go about your life. The feelings of guilt will come. There's nothing you can do about that. But you don't have to feed them. Just allow the feelings of guilt to come while you practice continuing to go about your life. In time, the guilt will fade. The point is that you were practicing living your life, despite the fact that the thoughts and the guilt are there. That is how you beat the OCD. You are actually not trying to remove the thoughts from your life. And you're not exactly trying to remove the guilt either. You are training yourself to live your life as a fully functioning human being, despite the fact that you may still be suffering from the thoughts. You are training yourself to manage and live successfully.

@Tea and Honey Also, a quick question, do you have a sense of "just right"? Sometimes people with "just right" OCD have a feeling of perfection that is only in a certain place, and anything off of that seems dangerous. Do you think that applies or no?

@Tea and Honey - First off all, I just want to thank you deeply for the help you're giving me. Honestly, this has been the best advice and support I’ve received in all these years. I truly mean it — thank you so so much :) :) About your question :Yes, I do relate to the idea of “just right,” but not in terms of order or symmetry. In my case, it has always been about moral scrupulosity. The perfection I seek isn’t visual or physical — it’s ethical. For many years now, this moral ideal of “perfection” has applied especially to the people I love the most, but above all to my sister. It’s almost like the type of OCD that usually latches onto cleanliness, order, or symmetry has been re-routed, in my case, toward morality. I hope that makes sense.

@Flávia Oliveira I think I understand:) You have nothing to worry about!! The "just right" OCD is treated just like any other form of OCD. (And if it's related to moral scrupulosity, that's fine too! It's treated in the same way no matter what.) I'll send you a video on "just right" OCD that might help you. It's not related to scrupulosity, but the principles will be the same. You can apply the same principles. Let's talk about how treatment would look for you: First, you stills allow your brain to generate whatever rules about your sister that it wants to. Second, you decide that you are going to take NO ACTION based on those "rules." In other words, you are going to do nothing different with your life regardless of whether or not OCD thought are (or are not) in your head. This can feel uncomfortable. But you have to learn to "ride out" the uncomfortable feeding feelings. They will start to naturally go away on their own. I am trying to figure out if you have any compulsion attached to the OCD thoughts? Is there any action you feel that you has to be done if your sister does not meet the "just right" feeling? Is there something you feel that you have to do? Is there something you feel that she hast to do? It could just even just be guilt that you feel? If you feel like you HAVE TO have a certain amount of guilt, that in itself can be an action/compulsion.

@Tea and Honey Sorry, there were a few typos in there, lol :)

@Flávia Oliveira Here are some videos you might try. They are from Nathan Peterson, who is one of my favorite therapists. https://youtu.be/zMR4mMuwZjs?si=PNDsVPCglveIDC0w https://youtu.be/54znJ9_3FtM?si=8EcRaXrI-szxjqxT

@Tea and Honey - No, it's really just the guilt. The feeling of guilt and fear for having these thoughts. Many times I think they might have nothing to do with OCD and that it's really just me thinking badly of my sister and questioning her actions. But I don't have any compulsion associated with it — I don't do anything, and there's no need for her to do anything either.

@Tea and Honey - Thank you very much!!!!

@Flávia Oliveira That's great! That is a good thing. Let's talk about your recovery path forward from here: Remember, it's OKAY if you think those bad thoughts about your sister. You are going to do two things: 1.). You are going to ALLOW all the bad thoughts about your sister that your brain wants to generate to run wild through your head. 2.) You are going to change your relationship/definition of the concept of "thoughts." You need to decide that ALL thoughts (including OCD and non-OCD thoughts) are actually MEANINGLESS. It does matter whether they are in your head or not. Once you decide that, you will really take a big step on your road to recovery. Now about the guilt.... you can't stop the guilt from coming. It's going to do that. But you can choose not to feed it. You can understand that it is "false" guilt. And you can treat it like a compulsion. This means that even though it wants your attention, you are going to keep on living your life. In order words, when the guilt is filling your heart, you go do the dishes anyway. You go walk the dog anyway, even if the guilt is there. Don't change anything about your life. Eventually, the OCD will realizing that its traps aren't working for you--and the guilt will subside on its own.

@Tea and Honey - Thank you so much for all the help and guidance you’ve been giving me. Your words make me feel less alone in this process and give me hope that I can really get better. I truly appreciate the time and care you’ve shown me. It really means a lot to me. I’m going to do exactly what you’re suggesting and follow your advice. I feel more hopeful knowing I have a clear path forward.

@Flávia Oliveira You got this!!! 💙💙😀😀💙💙 It's scary going forward in a new path. But you have to take the steps. Once you do, they become easier and easier. Big hugs 💙💙🤗🤗🤗

@Tea and Honey - Another thing that happens to me is questioning my sister's past actions. Doubts about things that happened years ago, but I'm left wondering if my sister did the right thing, if she was morally scrupulous... I spend the whole day with this in my head. And this week I'm going on vacation, and it's intensifying so I can't enjoy it....

@Flávia Oliveira Yes, your OCD is always going to flare up when you do things like go on vacation. You can just expect that is going to happen--and you can just accept it. It will always get more intense in these situations. However, consider that this is a good invitation and opportunity for you to practice your OCD skills. Therefore, it's not bad that you're going on vacation and your symptoms are flaring up. Instead, it's an opportunity for you to practice having victory in difficult situations. You need to treat this "other" OCD battle (about questioning your sister's past actions) exactly the same way you treat every other battle. It is all the same. And you are going to treat it the same. So your treatment will look like this: You need to ALLOW your brain to generate whatever negative or icky thoughts that it wants to. And just let those thoughts be there. But keep practicing taking NO action. Make yourself go on walks or play card games or do the dishes or talk with your family. Make yourself do these things, even though the negative feelings and thoughts are in the background. The negative feelings and thoughts are going to be there. And that is OK. You are practicing going on with your life, despite the fact that you feel uncomfortable or icky inside. And that is the secret to beating OCD. My mother-in-law called it "swimming parallel". Pretend you're at the beach and you are want to get to a lighthouse a mile away. You wish you were walking on the firm sand and enjoying the seashells and being with your family. But you are not. You are actually 30 yards out in the water, swimming parallel to the shore. You are still going to get to the Lighthouse. And you still can enjoy the shells and your family. But you are fighting these waves around you, as well as this constant fear of the water. It's OK. You need to know that this is OKAY. Someday, you will get back on the shore. But until that happens, you have to be content with just "swimming parallel" and living your life exactly the way you want to live it, even though you feel yucky inside.

@Tea and Honey https://i.pinimg.com/736x/01/72/ef/0172ef67831008f897b8e34e30e35138.jpg

@Tea and Honey This is a fun meme!!

@Tea and Honey - Thank you so much for everything! You can't imagine how much help you're giving me. Thank you for your empathy and immense generosity!!!!

@Flávia Oliveira Big hugs 💙😀💙 please write any time if you have more questions or want to talk more :):):) So glad that I can talk to you :)